"Motor Stop" vs Non "Motor Stop"

[Derek]

Ladies and gentlemen...."rookie question" coming up, lol. I'm just asking this because I want to understand.

Prior to my ZMR250, I had "motor stop" checked in Cleanflight. I believe it was Kev that suggested that I uncheck that box in Cleanflight for my ZMR because we were trying to sort out an esc issue. Now that my esc issue has been resolved, beautifully I might add, I'm still flying my ZMR with the "motor stop" off. I'm thinking that I like the fact that the motors are already at a certain rpm when the board is armed. However, if ever the quad were armed while it was still in my hands (doubtful, but possible) I don't believe that the rpm of the props would be high enough to cut much skin...I could be wrong...don't wanna find out, lol.

So, my question is this...during some "acro" flying, or "flow flying", are pilots getting to a bottom throttle, so that the props actually stop in the air, or are they just getting to a lower throttle, so that the props are still spinning and giving some control? Are they getting to the absolute low throttle position and the motors are still spinning (because the "motor stop" box is unchecked) or are they just getting down to a very low throttle position so that the props are simply spinning at a lower rpm?

I guess I'm just wondering because I'd like to get into a few loops and rolls today and I wonder how "out of position" the quad will get while maintaining rpm. Should I think of this just like flying my helicopters? Meaning, prior to a roll, give a bit of positive collective, then come off the collective, then begin the roll and then catching the helicopter with collective at the end of the roll? Or a loop...positive collective and throttle to gain altitude, then coming off the throttle and collective towards the top of the loop, then catching the helicopter with collective at the bottom of the loop?

Chances are....I'm just overthinking the whole thing (like that ever happens) and I should just go out.....gain some altitude and "do it".

[KevG]

Derek most pilots now use airmode, which at low zero throttle the quad keeps them spinning at the min throttle command amount,

now Airmode gives you cyclic control, so even though you have no throttle your motors will speed up to give you roll and pitch control.

[Derek]

Airmode??? geez....i'm, once again, behind, lol.

[Derek]

I see the latest version of Betaflight is 2.9.0. Can I simply get the betaflight naze32.hex and then set up Airmode?

I am using Betaflight 2.6.1 right now.

[KevG]

You have got airmode on 2.6.1 it on the modes tab, set it up in there

[Derek]

ok...i'll do that. I just checked YouTube for a few "how to" videos. looks simple enough. I hope my PID's don't need changed much. I still don't understand how to make educated changes to the PID's and I really like how my ZMR is flying right now....well...for the two fpv flights that I've been able to have.

[Derek]

Ideally, in the Modes Tab, what range should I set Airmode for? Or does it matter?

[Graham Lawrie]

In the modes i have air mode in the first section and position 0 on my three position switch. Then in Position 1 the middle on mode i have horizon, then position 2(Third position on switch on TX) i have Angle mode and beeper:)

[Derek]

I set up the ZMR for Airmode but when I tested it out in my front yard, the following happens...

I armed the board....props begin to spin (as expected) but then the front props continue to gain rpm and try to flip the quad over. I quickly disarmed the board and tried again and got the same results. So, I disabled Airmode and put the setting back to where they were when my quad was flying well. Retested and my quad flies fine...just no Airmode.

I watched this video for reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cm1h4wqjOQg

Perhaps, after enabling Airmode, I should have thought to calibrate the accelerometers (again). I don't know. I'll try again tomorrow at the Multirotor Event that is being held at my club field.

[Graham Lawrie]

Follow the following instructions Derek:

[Graham Lawrie]

Connect to Laptop.
In Motor section tick master and move slider to the top.
Plug battery in and wait for tune to finish then lower slider to the bottom.
Unplug battery now the Naze has max/min throttle settings.
Go back into motor settings and tick master and raise slider slowly taking note of what the motors turn at without spluttering on the lowest setting.
Go into configuration , Lower max throttle to 1950, and in min throttle the one above mid throttle remember the number the motors started at and add 20 to the value.
This should be the correct setting now when you arm the blades will turn at the setting you have set them to run at slowest speed with throttle at zero:)

[Derek]

Follow the following instructions Derek:

lol...I sure do like it when I get responses like this. You guys are just so much more experienced with the quad and it's great to be able to ask for help and to get a response like this. I'll print out your "instruction" post and I'll go over that in the morning before I leave for the fpv event.

Thanks Graham!!!

[Stambo]

Also don't try to take off or land with Airmode active Derek, have it on a switch that you turn on once you are in the air.
Otherwise it does strange things when you are on the ground.
The idea of airmode is to still have the flight control actively correcting the quad at zero throttle.
That means while you are upside down at zero throttle in a flip or roll the FC is still controlling the quad to keep it where you put it.
This allows the inverted hang time we are seeing from many of the better pilots.
Without airmode active this would be less possible.
The down side is that when the quad is on the ground at zero throttle with airmode active, the fc is trying to correct what it sees as an error, sees no correction so tries harder. This causes the bounces on landing and potential tip overs on take off if you arm but don't get in the air quick enough.

[Graham Lawrie]

I fly mine at arm and lift off in air mode and have never experienced this Stambo?:) Need to try this swapping the modes?

[Derek]

What about this other thing Im hearing about...idle up? What's that?

[Graham Lawrie]

I think, but could be wrong, thats Acro mode:)

[Stambo]

Idle up is where you mix some throttle, maybe 5 or 10 percent, to a switch so that you never actually come down to zero throttle.
This is what people used to do before air mode.
Some still do it rather than have the props spinning when armed.

[Derek]

so, it Airmode the same as Idle up? I'm thinking that I like having the props spin when I arm the Naze32 so I'll leave the Motor Stop box unchecked.

[Stambo]

so, it Airmode the same as Idle up? I'm thinking that I like having the props spin when I arm the Naze32 so I'll leave the Motor Stop box unchecked.

Not quite, idle up is similar to unchecking motor stop although the quad would likely not arm if idle up is active.
Airmode gives you zero throttle PID control in both situations although, as idle up gives you a percentage of throttle, the FC will never see you at zero throttle.
I too like the idea of props spinning when you arm, although I do turn them off when I am messing with settings.

[Derek]

Ok. Graham gave me instructions, above, on setting up Airmode. I'll give it a go when the sun comes up.